(Possibly) Epileptic Mouse

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(Possibly) Epileptic Mouse

Post by stephlisa on Thu Jan 11, 2018 8:56 am

So, we've had a hard day here...

Little Pumpkin had what basically looked like an epileptic fit/seizure. I'd rather not describe it as it was very stressful and painful to watch. It lasted about 5 seconds and he recovered quickly, being encouraged to both eat and drink. (Basil, to his credit, rushed up to Pumpkin to make sure his buddy was alright and comforted him).

We rushed to the vets (I *love* my vets) and got some advice.

She said that there were probably three options: 1) he has a congnitive problem 2) he has a problem with the blood getting to the brain (for example, either his heart is having problems getting it there or his liver isn't detoxifying the blood properly) or 3) he has epilepsy.

Being small mice, she decided not to do blood tests this time.

We're to monitor weight regularly and record any seizures (length of time in the seizure and length of recovery time), ensure he's safe during a seizure and in recovery (including making sure Basil doesn't start beating him up) and keep an eye on his eating and drinking habits. If things get worse, he loses weight or we're worried for any reason we're to take him back in for a check up. The vet is a good friend of ours so I know she'll do our best for our boys.

My questions for the forum:
1) have any of you had a similar situation?
2) do I need to change anything in the cage to make sure Pumpkin is both safe and able to get what he needs (while ensuring that Basil still has plenty of things to climb on and play on)?
3) if it is epilepsy, is there any triggers I can reduce to make things easier for my baby?

Thank you all!

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Re: (Possibly) Epileptic Mouse

Post by CallaLily on Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:51 am

How scary! Sad I don't have any advice but I hope he's doing ok now. Please keep us updated. Hugs

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Re: (Possibly) Epileptic Mouse

Post by scaredymouse on Thu Jan 11, 2018 4:07 pm

Aw, how scary! I'm sure all the same holds true for mice with seizures as with people. I had a cat with seizures, so i know how hard it is to watch them suffer like that. My cat ended up having a brain tumor, so for her she started having occasional seizures that slowly increased in frequency and severity until she died. I can tell you that in something like 50% of animals/people that have a seizure never have another one.

So there isn't really anything you *need* to do. If it makes you feel better, you can make their climbing less high. But I'm of the opinion that he should get to do everything that makes him happy, even if there is a risk of falling. animals usually know when their seizures are coming on and they want to get to the ground. There isn't really anything you can do to prevent them, other than avoiding bright flashing lights. All of the other factors are out of your control.

I had a little mouse that had a series of seizures while he was dying, it was just part of his dying process. i don't think at all that's what's going on with your guy! I just wanted to say that I've seen it before, it was sad Sad

Keep us posted.

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Re: (Possibly) Epileptic Mouse

Post by stephlisa on Thu Jan 11, 2018 4:52 pm

Here's hoping little Pumpkin doesn't have another.

I was also of the opinion he should be allowed to do everything that makes him happy. This afternoon that was basically sleeping on my chest and then going home and snuggling with his brother. He's definitely feeling it a little as he's quite nervous today and being wary of things that are too high or that move alot (e.g. the seesaw and swing I've got in the cage) so he seems to know his limits.

I'm glad I don't *have* to reduce their climbing - because they do both enjoy it when they are feeling up to it. Fortunately their cage has 3 levels so he'd never normally be too far away from a safe floor. (The levels are whole floorspace - like the upstais of a human house).

Poor boy. The vet doesn't think he's in any pain from the seizures and is most likely unconscious and doesn't remember them at all. She's is inclined to think its a case of bad genetics/breeding as he's only 5 months old. I'm hoping we can nurse him to a decent age **crosses fingers**

I'll keep this thread updated with his news Smile

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Re: (Possibly) Epileptic Mouse

Post by scaredymouse on Thu Jan 11, 2018 5:03 pm

I don't think they hurt at all. But he will be disoriented afterward and would welcome snuggles and enjoy the comfort of his momma.

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Lady mice: Winnifred & Sally/Georgie & Harriet Potter, Spec, Erzulie, Lucille, Clementine
Gentleman mice:  Lil Smokey, Magnus, Norman, Alexander
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Other pets: Little Buddy, Kevin (cats) Sherberta, Dustin, Lidiya, Chip, Squiggy, Nina, Harold, Spike, Mia, Mim, Henrietta(hamsters), Chloe and Zoey (chinchillas), Herman/Figaro Whooopers/Burlington (guinea pigs)
Rainbow Angel  Penny, Honeybun, Lucy, Annie, Gilly, Furgie, Tedward Wigglesworth, Olivia, Goose, Sweet Katie, Binky, Delilah, Bitsy, Boopers, Sprout, Splotchy, Eva, Slappy, Shuggie, Fancy Pants, Jellybean, Charlie, Murray, Sally, Maya, Gunther.
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Re: (Possibly) Epileptic Mouse

Post by stephlisa on Fri Jan 12, 2018 4:56 am

He had another seizure this morning. Poor baby. Seems fine now though. :-(

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Re: (Possibly) Epileptic Mouse

Post by CallaLily on Fri Jan 12, 2018 6:19 pm

@stephlisa wrote:He had another seizure this morning.  Poor baby.  Seems fine now though.  :-(

Oh no, poor baby! Worry How's he doing now?

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Re: (Possibly) Epileptic Mouse

Post by stephlisa on Sat Jan 13, 2018 4:22 am

So Pumpkin was fine for rest of yesterday (Friday).
We think there might have been another seizure this morning before we got up because both the mice were snuggled up together in a toilet roll tube on the top level where they never normally sleep and Basil wouldn't leave Pumpkin's side for a while. Pumpkin has since been acting like a normal little mousey, begging for treats and such.

Its highly worrying and stressful from my perspective...

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Re: (Possibly) Epileptic Mouse

Post by stephlisa on Tue Jan 16, 2018 3:29 am

Just wanted to give you all an update. Pumpkin started looking brighter and was more interested in doing his usual mousey things over the weekend. He started looking a bit happier again. Last night, he voluntarily came out to play with me <3

I suspect we will have good days and bad days for the rest of his life, happy moments and sad ones, but it was nice to are him being a mouse again and enjoying his toys and my company. It will be a case of enjoy the good days when they are here and support him on the bad ones.

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Re: (Possibly) Epileptic Mouse

Post by CallaLily on Tue Jan 16, 2018 8:17 am

Awww. I'm glad to hear he's having some good days. Hearts

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Re: (Possibly) Epileptic Mouse

Post by Frizzle on Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:16 am

I had a mouse once that had seizures due to a head injury as a pup. They were triggered by going into the mouse's cage/startling the mouse, and it got progressivly worse with age. That mouse did get PTS due to quality of life, there is a "mouse grimace scale" that you might want to reference if you need to brush up on pain indicators.

Sorry you and your mouse are going through this.

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Re: (Possibly) Epileptic Mouse

Post by stephlisa on Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:01 am

Yes, I've seen the mouse grimace scales - I regularly use those to keep an eye on the behaviour of both my mice.  I can tell when Pumpkin is unhappy because his little ears aren't up and alert!

As an update for Pumpkin though...

He's been doing well recently.  He still has seizures but they only about 2 a week at the moment.  We still haven't worked out any triggers.  It seems very random currently - we're working on that though.  A good thing to come out of this illness is that he's becoming much tamer and more social able with us - its like he's learnt that I'm only there to help and look after him.  He's very calm about it all, and apart from during and directly after a seizure, you would never know there is anything wrong with him.  As per the vets directions we're trying to feed him up and his although his weight hasn't increased, he's stayed at a steady 23g for a while now. (At least he isn't losing weight!). For comparison, Basil is only around 25g so I think we just have small mice (at least compared to our previous boy!).

So all in all, while the seizures are stressful, I wouldn't say they are impacting his quality of life yet and he still enjoys all his usual activities!

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Re: (Possibly) Epileptic Mouse

Post by CinnamonPearl on Wed Jan 24, 2018 6:47 am

How much did he weigh before this all started?

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Re: (Possibly) Epileptic Mouse

Post by stephlisa on Wed Jan 24, 2018 9:37 am

Pumpkin has only ever weighed at most 25g and that was a little before Christmas. He may also have lost a little weight over Christmas due to the stress of travelling with us but I wasn't as good at weighing them while we were away so I don't know for certain.
Basil's weight has generally been steady since before Christmas and it hovers around 26g - occassionally going up or down 1g each week.
They are just over 5 months old which I think means they're basically fully grown now?
They were both absolutely tiny when we got them though so they may have been runts of the litter.

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Re: (Possibly) Epileptic Mouse

Post by stephlisa on Tue Jan 30, 2018 6:11 am

It is with sadness I have to say that Pumpkin passed in my hands this morning.
His final seizure was too long and severe. There was nothing more I could have done.
I am too grieved to write a memorial yet. I will try another time. He was so young, only 5 months and 3 weeks old. We all thought he'd live much longer. Heartbroken. Crying or Very sad

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